Agreed and I can see Bro Dartagnan's points.

How should a punter treat a WG is the same question to me as

1. how should a man treat his wife?

2. how should friends treat each other?

3. how should colleagues treat each other? (etc etc)

We should not hold each other to a "standard", there is in fact no "standard". You treat them how you want to treat them, I think we all agree that we of all people shouldn't judge. Further, as mentioned above, all WGs (like other people) are different, and I treat each of them differently (like I treat each of my friends differently).

Do what you think you must, I definitely do what I think I should. Like the way I treat everyone else, I try to treat them with respect and dignity, and on occasion, generously. We probably all fall within parts of akka's categories, but so what. Showboats or fuckwits will always remain showboats or fuckwits, whether with WGs or with other people.

Live and let live I say. You don't answer to anyone but yourself (or to God if you're religious), so do what you want, when you want.

[ Last edited by  ypmypm at 17-8-2010 00:54 ]

I find it amusing that you are getting so worked up all over my tone in posting on an internet forum.  I didn't write anything confrontational, nor aggressively controversial.  There's no reason for you to take such umbrage.  

Anyhow, it seems clear to me that you have never punted in China before.  I don't want to imply anything, but perhaps you should try it one day?  It will be an eye-opener at the very least.

Hey bro,

you're right I've never punted in China, and maybe one day I will.  That has nothing whatsoever to do with the posts in this thread.  

As I said, I'm very interested in your experience and also in your perspectives.  

What I'm objecting to is your multiple statements that guys who are generous to WGs THEY MEET IN HONG KONG somehow are getting it wrong.  Your posts are peppered with "should"s and "unnecessary"s.  

Obviously that's too fine a distinction for some of the people reading this ...

but given how influential comments posted here are, I'm pointing out "it ain't necessarily so" in order to maintain a balanced perspective.  

YOUR attitude to how to treat WGs is yours.  Tell us about it, we want to get to know how you play.  

But please don't put down those who choose to be generous.  It's bleeding obvious it's unnecessary: they only have to pay $800 each time.  That's the market.  It's their choice to tip.

All getting very contentious. Interesting though, if its a freelancer I often would feed her before fucking the shit out of her. This is purely so she has stamina though, and wont need to run off before the I've had MY fill of her due to hunger.

Not heard from any of the laptop / camera buying dudes yet. A meal is nothing really but when it comes to 5k+ worth of electronics one has to wonder why - you just have to.

I must disagree with you on your point about never punting in China.  I think if someone who has only tried the WGs in HK and not from the motherland has a lot of bearing to do with what I think is "unnecessary" treatment.

For example, suppose I fly into HK, try a couple HGs, think the world of them, smitten with their charm, their beauty, exoticness (if you're not Asian), yada yada yada.  They I lavish them, spoil the shit out of them.  If I then proceed to cross the border into Shenzhen or wherever, I will have two different perspectives.  And therein lies the rub.

Someone who enjoys these HGs and WGs in HK simply needs to go to the Motherland and experience the bounties there.  There I will see that there are a shitload of gals who can be HGs in HK and all this stuff they do for them, i.e., treat them like a million bucks, is unnecessary.  They will then see what these gals are all about, and how, IMHO, it's not necessary for them to go to these over the top, unusual measures.

Here's another example - we (Hunt, me and Goober) were in CA at MGM KTV.  I picked some chick, got back to the hotel.  Not going to get into details, but after the first pop, I fall asleep, she stays up to watch TV, I then wake up at 4AM and she's still watching that stupid sheep wolf cartoon.  She doesn't sleep at all, snacks on whatever I bought for her (yes, contrary to what ppl may think in this forum, I am not an animal to these gals, I buy snacks and shit), etc.  I ask her why doesn't she sleep?  She's said she's just happy that she gets to lie around and watch TV in a relatively comfy hotel room and relax.   This gal could've easily been an 800 HG.  

Yet another example - in some rooms there are computers with internet access.  Or you bring your laptop.  These chicks will not sleep.  All they will do is go online and go on QQ or whatever and chat.  

So - if these gals are so easily satisfied (not sexually, mind you), then why would I drop thousands on these gals?  This is why I find it unnecessary.  Like I reiterated before, if some guy wants to drop thousands of bucks on these HGs, knock yourself out.  But seriously, it's overkill.  In my opinion.  A lot of guys who have been to both sides will agree with me.

Furthermore, might I add, these chicks are like bun buns - a lot of them are in the same circles and gab.  Get ready to buy a dozen LV bags.  You don't want to be THAT guy.

A regular meal is fine - a meal at the Four Seasons followed by a couple bottles of champagne at Dragon-I or some shit - now that's going over the top.  

I'm just saying there's no need to go overboard.  Even if I had Li Ka Shing money I wouldn't do it.  It's excessive, quite frankly.

You're doing it again!  You're missing the point ... and yes, Hunt, I do think it's condescending that he's telling us (me) I shouldn't take a girl to Four Seasons   
Just as he has a right to state his opinion I have a right to respond to it

I'm not disagreeing with you that there is a big opportunity in China.  
Clearly there are actually not one, but two markets in play.  There's the direct pay-for-play price.  Then there's the MUTUAL game of how much more the guy and the girl try to get from each other.  She tries to make him feel great, and tries to get cash in return.  He tries to show her he's worth more than the other guys, and tries to get her to treat him better than other girls do.  
I'm also not disagreeing that guys can get ripped off by greedy suppliers who demand as much as they can get away with.  This forum is a great resource for helping bros pay a fair price and avoid the worst excesses.  

But neither of those is your thesis: you're saying - repeatedly - that guys SHOULDN'T give generously (for some reason you haven't stated yet) and you're diminishing the guys who CHOOSE TO.  
Doing all that stuff is FOR THE GUY, not for the girl.  From that perspective it has nothing whatsoever to do with where the girl came from, how short a time the guy visited HK, or anything else that I can think of.  HE is having fun, and if he wants to take her to Four Seasons and then strut in Dragon-I, WHY NOT?  Just because you choose not to do those things, you're diminishing those who can afford to and want to.  

You've made a strong case for saving money by going to China and having more pickings ... and that's true IF YOUR GOAL IS TO SAVE MONEY.  But you've not answered WHY NOT give more?  Yet you keep telling us we SHOULDN'T.  That's ridiculous!  

... and yes, like Akka I would also like to hear from the laptop-and-LV brigade    I'm convinced they have a story to tell that would make things more complete!

My goal in creating this thread is not for everyone here to SAVE money.  It's for everyone to not WASTE money.

If he has the money and wants to spend it, where is the waste???  

I don't get it.  

Again, I'm delighted to hear your experiences, and would love to hear more about what you've done in PRC.

Dart,

I dont know where u are heading with this.

Frankly, since you admit you never punt in China, your perspective is totally different from those who does. They way you treat a PRC WG will also be different. So, you will never understand unless you try it yourself.

Beth, presented his opionion "not to waste unnecessary money on PRC WGs", if you do not intend to privatise them or make em your FBs. Waht;s the point, fuck and go, dime a dozen.
He is not obliged to share of his china experiences or else the more he share, the more you are going to pick on his wiriting since you are looking at angles, so this is pointless. You can just check the china section for past reports.

[ Last edited by  hunter at 17-8-2010 10:06 ]

We're not seeing eye to eye here, obviously.  I'm fine with leaving it that way.

Hunt, I'm saying there's a big difference between saying "you can have the same girl for less across the border", and saying "you shouldn't give expensive gifts to WGs in Hong Kong".  There's no hidden angle in that, I think one is right and the other is wrong.  

I don't recall you ever telling us what we shouldn't do ... and I feel discouraging people from being generous is misguided.

Sure, you can always pay less by going direct to source.  But it's not at all the same thing, the opportunities risks and rewards are completely different, as anyone who reads PRC reports knows.  
And if some guy happens to want the experience of a flash dinner in Four Seasons, why not?  He won't get that experience in Shenzhen, not for any amount of money, and I'm not seeing why we have to make him wrong.  

I for one am very happy to be living (and punting) in a city where guys are often generous to girls ... it increases the size of the pool for everyone ... which is why I want to speak out for the underdog.

Let me inject some observations and experiences from long ago ...

Back in the early / mid 1990's HK was booming ... walk ups and HGs were almost non existant
(there were many brothels for the working class), for the affulent, night clubs and saunas were
the main places to go to find WGs (there were also some private clubs).

In those days (for about 6 years running) money was easy to earn and spent just as easily,
ordinary night club or sauna girls monthly income would be around 200-300K,
the hotter girls would take in at least 500K.
the major part of that income would be from the tiping from their Johns ... a high proportion would also be wined
and dined in the most expensive restaurants. Yes all these WGs were spoilt and if you didn't have money
they wouldn't even look at you ... but those were the circumstances at that time ...

If these girls were cleaver enough they would have saved their money and would be well off after the boom
but sadly, most gambled away everything ... circumstances changed and like wise, the earning power of these WGs
changed in proportion ... even the better WGs nowdays will be lucky to make 150-200 K ...

so its all a mater of economics ... if girls gets spoilt when times are good they get un spoilt when times are bad

I guess you right.
Depend on circumstances, where and when.

You spoil when you need to.

Another point, most of this gal back in the 90's and 80's are local Hongkie WG, no?

I still recall 10 yrs ago in 2000, was in HK/China city KTV club - TST, we cant even take out the local HK KTV gal, even offering a pop $5K, they refuse.
Charge the sitting fee by every 15 minutes.
Some cocky and rich biatches back then......

Things are much covenient and accessible now, spoiling is less required when is come to mongering, unless you want to privatise them.

I also want to say this ...

everyone's got their own way of dealing with women ... wives / GF / WG whatever,
its no use telling anyone how much they should spend ... they do what they want to do !
everyone's objective is different - some may want just a one time bang, some may want
something slightly longer term (even if its not to the extent to privatise) ...

People will spent what they want to spend up to the llimit of what they can afford and some idiots
will spend more then that if they sink !

Even in this forum there are many bros who was worried about too much tiping for the WGs
and spoiling them ... but has that stoped ?

I remember those were the bad ol' days when a veggie massage girl would demand $1,000 just for a HJ and a punter would actually go for it.

In those days most were local girls ... PRC girls had difficulty coming to HK

in those good ole days ... KTVs were for the less affluent ... it was night clubs ... night clubs ... night clubs

and the local girls were sooooooo good !!!!

I went to that nite club with my uni buddy.
My uni buddy was due to get married in 3 mths time and i know her wife pretty well and i must admit she is hot and gorgeous, still to this very day.
When the lineups came in, me and my uni buddy were laughing out loud. Why?
Bcos one of the KTV gal looks exactly like her wife....
He wanted to pick her but he felt eerie and uncomfy looking into her face.
So I picked that gal......

Those were time, local HK KTV gal, sure hot!!!!!!!

Bill was crazy expensive though......

[ Last edited by  hunter at 17-8-2010 11:54 ]

I think we all went for it !  right Geo ?  

In those days the top sauna in TST was VIP sauna
a 2 session massage would cost about $900 and for a HJ the tip
would need to be at least $800 if its the first time with the girl ...
subsequent visits with the same girl would mean better HJ service
and better tip - $1K to 1.5K !!!  
there were many clients who would tip 5K for the girl and $100 for attendents - every attendent !  

The top 10 girls in that sauna would make about 600K a month - tax free !!!

PRC gals have changed the whole scene since then - you think for the better?