Can we please put this to a rest now ... in this world, there are no definitives and as I said before even experts
can't agree ... so we just have to use whatever common sense we have to know the difference !

I just read the thread and what can I say???  

IT'S GREAT!!!

Do you think it a good idea/would you consider C+P the two posts up on the Fighting Thread as it would make a VERY GOOD basis for expounding AND DISCUSING what constitutes acceptable behaviour - without any fears of reprisal - as NO Karma/acceptance points are allowed on said board.

SEAJ
edits for spelling/grammatical sense

[ Last edited by  SEAJ at 20-1-2010 16:02 ]

OK … lets clear everything up once and for all …

sylvan made the following replies in the HK reports section:

1.
I think GN is very cute, and she has a very nice smile in these pictures. I'd give her a try if I ever get the chance.
[No Rating]

2.
I like the perky nipples. Is that a tattoo on front of her hip?
[No Rating]

3.
Cute girl, too bad for the terrible service. I normally prefer the cute and petite over the sex kitten/pornstar types.

Recent Ratings
pisser
  20-1-2010 14:19          Acceptance          +2          OK reply bro.
swan
  29-11-2009 07:51          Karma          -1          that's irrelevant! go read the FAQ!
test3
  29-11-2009 00:11          Acceptance          -1          WTF?

4.
I didn't say she was a pornstar, did you read the first 2 words of my post? I was merely stating my overall preference (ie opinion of cute vs pornstar) and I thought it was a relevent comment, even though some people who have been here more than a week might disapprove. I apologize for my naive attempt at making conversation. No need to flame. Why don't you guys save your negative karma for someone who is actually disruptive to the forum?

[ Last edited by  Sylvan at 29-11-2009 01:10 ]

Recent Ratings
pisser
  20-1-2010 14:18          Acceptance          +3          Don't worry bro.
test3
  30-11-2009 13:30          Acceptance          -2          READ FAQ!
                               

5.
Wow, that's a lot of pictures I can't see. About how long does it take to get to access 30 anyway?

Recent Ratings
grantbone
  29-11-2009 02:32          Karma          -2

6.
You would think they could get some kind of on-the-job training when they come to Hong Kong. Someone needs to open a hooker school. If I got a girl like this I would ask the papasan to pay me to train her.
[No Rating]


Sylvan also stated the following:
“I would give you positive karma or acceptance if I could pisser. I have been lurking for a while since my first few posts got slammed a couple months back. There really isn't any illusion of free speech in this forum with this acceptance system. If we don't say what everyone wants to hear, then we lose a lot of points. Even if we are trying to be helpful or offer good advice.”

I believe if sylvan read and understood the Forum Etiquette thread there would be no need to post this reply !
To me # 3 was borderline, #1, #2, #5, #6 were totally irrelevant and ratings were/would have been appropriate !   
#4 was in defense of himself and should not have been rated – an explanation would have been better.

BUT … I do not see where or how he has "tried to be helpful or offer good advise in any of these replies !"

thanks SEAJ.


I won't - I wrote it as a public contribution, to stimulate debate and in the intention to raise the quality of all our contributions.  My bit's done.  

But feel free to C&P / quote / improve / correct all you like.

oh no .... don't stop the party!  

A tussle with Mars is a sort of a rite of initiation ... helps to figure out who can compose a sequence of articulate thoughts, and who can't ... leave him off the leash!!  He keeps us all fit!

Hey SEAJ, this is hilarious ...


Yes.

Of course YOU have noticed neg K slowed down ... it's because YOU have slowed down and moderated your style!!!

If you'd been here longer, before you arrived (OK I know that's impossible) you'd have noticed waves come and go, and neg K tends to be narrowly focussed on one or two individuals who are testing the patience of mods and seniors ... most of the time there's not just "less" but NONE.  There's MUCH more +K awarded than there ever has been -K.  

Neg A is of course a more fluid matter.  Inevitably, since anyone can award it, and we know it has no lasting impact.

You know what?  

That actually IS the objective of neg K when it is awarded.  

We don't want LOTS of posts.  We want lots of USEFUL posts.  If you get neg K, by all means seek an explanation: there are written and unwritten guidelines about what is useful and what is considered undesirable.  

But don't just assume it's not justified.  If it's not justified, someone pretty soon reverses it.  

And always remember -1 K only has the effect of reversing the credit for a single post.  You can make up -2 K by making a single new post.  Neg K is escalated precisely to avoid situations where a pugilistic contributor builds up his credit by stringing out a contrived argument.  

You're not alone.  A number of the senior members made false starts (some smaller, some larger).  The ones that adjusted are still here, and are even more valuable contributors than before.

Will C+P it to the fight club - Mucho gracias

SEAJ
Edit for spelling

[ Last edited by  SEAJ at 20-1-2010 20:25 ]

Any one of us can go off the deep end sometimes.  I know that I've been gullty and I also see that Mars - who BTW I do admire for his wit and writing abilities, IMHO has also at times done so.

You say a sort of rite of initation and I say it is a juvenille frat house initation that has no place in an adult forum.

Yes, I know that Frat BOYS find it's amusing to watch the "freshmen' gets bruised and bloodied by the Senior jokester/bully - but at what cost?  At turning away good prospective contributors?  There are TONS of other forums anybody can join - WITHOUT being bullied as soon as one steps in.

SEAJ

Good ONE!!!

Yes - I happen to love these kind of going back and forth - but I'd think that a lot of others would not even be bothered .

You and I both know that just about ANY post can be taken apart - but to me, the deciding factor whetehr to do so or not  is if it's gonna do myself any good and then if its gonna do the whole forum good too.

And the worst is of course those neg karmas "gifts" that a newcomer feels so aggrieved - and powerless against.  And which IMHO has just been given TOO arbitrarily AND too many times in anger.  Mars is actually a good example of how one can AND SHOULD be acting when in a debate: He does NOT (at least I don't think so!) Neg karmas even if the situation is heated.

Yes - I hate school yard bullyings - and that is how I many times perceive neg karmas - bullying when one cannot carry out an intelligent discourse.

SEAJ

OK - there ARE of course a lot (A LOT!) of posts that are of negligible value etc - but there are also times when it-s 50-50.  Its ALL a matter of opinion

but then Wham - some senior or another who happens to harbour a grudge from some forgotten events (by the post writer) comes on and really screws him against teh wall with max neg karmas.  

Matters of opinion includes things like writing style, length of report, joke or no joke, asking silly questions (but not to the questioner - why wud he ask otherwise?)., etc etc - and I just find it totally ridiculous that ANYBODY would be awarded Neg karmas for 50-50% things.

And then the Frat house cheering section comes on (to me - these are the REAL shoe shine boys) and validates and Ra Ra Ra gives some more neg Karmas.

is that any way for adults to behave?

SEAJ

what might be 50/50 for you might not be for others ... very subjective !

50-50, 99-1, 1-99 - don't matter -  just so long as there is a degree of doubt, I'd suggest that one must err on the conservative side with newcomers.

Whatever the percentage, a senior can - and should only -  double check his own 100% belief on subsequent posts.

SEAJ

what you're really saying is that you want to impose your values onto others

Not impose - CONVINCE others to think properly before awarding negative karmas.

We have acceptance points to "educate"

Negative Karma points are soooo destructive iMHO - and should only be used for posters who really are being an A..hole.

SEAJ

BTW - IMPOSE is when one senior or another uses his negative karma giving - and banning powers - to impose himself on another.

Howzabout you transferring a few of these posts - say from #75 to the fight club?  edit in bold

[ Last edited by  SEAJ at 20-1-2010 20:49 ]

That's the problem with your thinking ... who you deem to be A hole(s) in this forum may not
necessarily be the A hole(s) others perceive to be.

Again, that's your opinion and not necessarily the opinion of others !

THAT is precisely what I am talking about.  Everybody has their own opinion and everybody should be ABLE to express his own opinion WITHOUT somebody IMPOSING his opinion/powers/bullying by awarding negavitve karmas.

SEAJ

YES -  but I'm even afraid of replying to you again as somebody's liable to neg me for .... whatever.

Opinion - agree to disagree, having a gentlemanly discourse - all that goes with opinion.  NOT bullying in my OPINION

SEAJ

you can't control what others do, how they post, what they read in other people's writing and how they rate others ...
this forum works this way, to try and control this is a way of imposing your values on to others !