Would you do it? Is it safe? Provided you have no cuts in your mouth.

no if she provided rimming services

Listen..., NOTHING is totally safe in this game.

Exchanging saliva can transmit herpes (both oral and genital herpes, incidentally), gonorrhea, and other viruses or bacterial infections.  The risks are lower than bareback sex, mind you, due to saliva being a rather hostile environment for bugs to live in..  yet survive some do and you can get (or transmit) various different types of STIs just from making out.

Anytime you come in contact with the bodily fluids of another person you are at risk.  Even wearing a condom with a super-wet gal who drips all over your balls exposes you to whatever infections she may have.  The risks diminish greatly in this case, but even a micro-abrasion on your balls opens you up to exposure.  

Keep in mind aswell... most people, especially women, experience no symptoms at all when infected by many STIs (Clamydia, gonorrhea) but they are still infected and will still transmit it to you.  And you may experience no symptoms either (or, if unlucky, experience really nasty ones!).  So you can easily give an STI to your SO even though you never knew you were infected.  Sadly, even though a woman may see no outward symptom the health risks for woman can be quite high if not treated (becoming sterile, kidney damage, cancer risks).  Scary stuff!

Make no mistake.  We take risks every time we punt.

Listen to Wander and take heed young Jedi.  I did not, and caught an unidentified STD that caused my left ass cheek to fall off one day.  People now call me a 'half-assed so-and-so' behind my back, but trust me I hear the whispers!

Disease transmission is largely a matter of virulence and statistics and all the bugs out there (and we've only identified a small portion) are different in how contagious they are.  Smallpox (irradicated thank heavens) was airborne and extremely virulent for example, just a few virus particles can infect you, HIV otoh is not airborne, does not survive well in saliva and needs a particular route into the body, TB, is different still, all these nasties have their own preference for how they make you sick, but at least the STDs can't do it at a distance or with a sneeze.    Cut down your exposure (i.e. wear a condom) as much as possible, and eliminate it altogether (e.g., no BB anal) where you can and you'll most likely do fine.

Besides communicability, the other item that has come to give me the most pause is the very low access, or use of, health care by the girls in the unregulated environments.  If they never go to get checked, they could still be sporting last year's (or the year before!) chlamydia.  So be on thy guard!

Yea, that's a clear NO.

My last punt tried kiss me, but she kissed on my face and not my lips. I like to think my facial hair stopped all the nasties from getting to my bloodstream. I went to 7-11 and got some alcohol wipes and used half the package on my face so I think I'm safe.

@TheButler - are you exaggerating? You mean your butt cheek just fell off??

Bro Wantthisforever,

Unless you look like a member of ZZ Top your facial hair wouldn't stop shit!
If you are worried about a peck on the cheek then perhaps this hobby isn't for you?

Just be wise with the activities you do with the WG.

Obe

I can't tell if this sort of belief is the result of poor sex education in schools, a person getting their sex education from friends or a person's own ignorance. And not just this thread but there have been others where I really can't believe that the health and sex education is so bad.

Anyways, 1.) Facial hair won't stop any "nasties;" and 2.) This game has risks and it's up to you whether you want to take that risk or not.

To each own.
We cant teach a bro how to fuck.
Some like to smooch/tongue fuck the chick while some dont.

If you think you like to take the risk (bacteria, germs, etc.), go ahead.
If you are a very hygenic person and concern with body/fluids contact, do otherwise.
Hell, you should even not take up this activity and stay home.

Regarding the "hair", agreed with freelancer.....WTF!!!!

Yes, I would kiss/make-out with a WG, and here's why.

The bacterial STD infections can be easily treated by taking an antibiotic for several days. It's similar to what you'd do if you got strep throat.

HIV/AIDS is essentially unheard of via oral transmission, and female-to-male from vaginal sex is rare (but I still wear a condom for vaginal sex). It is less rare (but still rare) for anal sex (and would always wear a condom for that with a WG).

Herpes I -- you probably have it already, from being kissed by an aunt as a 10 year old.

Herpes II -- If you don't already have it (and I don't), there is risk from vaginal sex. While there's also risk from DATY or getting head, it turns out that Herpes II is pretty benign if it settles in/around your mouth. And once you have it, you can't get it somewhere else. Most people who have it don't know it because they are asymptomatic. However, some are very symptomatic, and it is not pleasant to have HSV 2 genitally. Also, if you see sores or pimples on the girl, run away.

Hep B -- You don't want to get this. Get vaccinated before mongering, then don't worry about it ever again.

HPV -- There is now a shot for this, but for some reason they only give it to kids. I'm not worried about it -- seems more of a problem for women.

Crabs/lice/creepy-crawlies -- Well, check carefully first. Or stick to shaved girls!

Others -- Well, there are certainly others, but once again, they can typically be treated. If it smells or tastes, stay away.

Also, and this is just something I developed myself: if I'm doing a week's heavy mongering, I prophylactically take azithromycin (4 x 250mg pills the evening before, then one every 36 hours thereafter until the last day). There is some (but not a lot) of evidence that this kind of "ounce of prevention" is pretty effective. Especially if one is married, this may be worth considering.

Ok, this is probably too much information, but I did research it very carefully about 5 years ago, and these are the conclusions I came to. Nothing I've read since then has changed my mind.

Gherkin


[ Last edited by  ggherkin at 15-1-2013 20:54 ]

Wow

some radical views here

Feel some perspective is required ...


OMG, can't believe you just said that!!?!  

Yeah, HPV is indeed "more of a problem for women".  Top-ten list death-grade problem that is.  
Why ..?
Cancer is one of the top causes of death for women,
and cervical cancer is one of the top causes of cancer in women,
and HPV is THE cause of cancer in women.  Just HPV.  

But you're right, you don't need to worry, because in men it causes no symptoms.  Unless you get genital warts that is ... but those are pretty obvious and they freeze them off your birdie until they stop growing.  No biggie.  The nasty cancer-producing strains of HPV are asymptomatic in men.  

But that's not true for your partner.  

... oh, and a condom isn't protection ... research is waking up to proven infection passing from his dick to her hand / from her pussy to his hand / from his hand to her pussy / from her hand to his dick ... and the research continues.  Clearly a resourceful little bug at getting around, and any degree genital contact is sufficient to spread it.  Medical advice is that anyone who "had 1 new partner each year during 4 years of college" is pretty much sure to have HPV already.

So it seems the appropriate perspective on HPV is a guy doesn't need to worry as long as he only ever fucks girls who have already been fucked by a number of other guys.  Assume you have it.  Assume your girl will have it - and either she will give her version to you (there are dozens of different ones) and assume your next partner will receive the sum total of the various strains of HPV you have been exposed to.  The record on HPV is evolving, and new research is contradicting old assumptions.

You do not want your latest beloved - and besottedly faithful - girlfriend coming to you and telling you one day that her recent PAP smear shows she has one of the cancer-causing strains, and she knows it came from you.  Plan accordingly.  

excuse the rant, I just felt some more detail was useful on this one ...


This behaviour sounds like one of the root causes of the accellerated evolution of antibiotic-resistant super-bugs.  

There's nothing worse than to take a reduced dose of antibiotics over a period of time.  All that does is kill SOME of the bugs, and the ones that remain, evolve and learn to resist the drug.  

Only right way to take an antibiotic is with a full course, taken regularly (e.g. 3x per day), continued to the end of the course regardless of symptoms.  Anything less is not just stupidly selfish, because it generates bugs that kill other people, but actually raises the risk of generating a superbug inside your own body that will make you be the Index Case of a new generation of nasty.

Hi DArtagnan, and thanks for the though-provoking post. I will take another look at HPV based on your comments. Still, of all the STDs, it seems to be one of the ones that men come down with the least, despite hand jobs being very prevalent.

But just to be clear, when I said more of a problem for women, I meant just what you said -- that treatment of symptoms (warts) for men is fairly straightforward, but not so for women. I include HPV in my standard annual STD test package, and haven't caught it yet. Maybe just lucky, or maybe another overblown risk. Each of us must decide for himself.

I must disagree with you about the antibiotic prophylaxis though. Low dose antibiotic prophylaxis has become common prior to many surgeries. The idea is to prevent an infection from taking hold, rather than treating the infection once it has taken hold. Two very different uses of antibiotics, and two very different dosage regimes. Low dose and short timeframe is how the prophylaxis works. High dose and long timeframe is how the "antibiotic as cure" approach works. If you would like to learn more, try googling something like "antibiotic prophylaxis surgery".

Whenever this particular subject comes up, someone always talks about whether this is why antibiotic resistant bacteria are developing. I'm not 100% certain, but I don't think so. The reason is that resistant strains develop when incomplete courses of antibiotics are taken, allowing the strongest of the bacteria to multiply and escape to infect someone else, while killing the weak ones. But since prophylaxis at the low and short doses is designed to completely prevent an infection to begin with, I don't think it is the case here. Certainly it has become common in hospital surgery. But I can understand why, on first glance, it looks like it might be an irresponsible usage of antibiotics. It isn't though, for the reasons given.

Thanks

Gherkin

[ Last edited by  ggherkin at 16-1-2013 06:01 ]

Thanks for the replies everyone, and shout outs to ggherkin.

I was being sarcastic about the facial hair.

My last few posts here were about me not being able to cum as a new punter, and some posters suggested that I had de-sensitized my penis due to frequent masturbation. I was close to cumming at my most recent punt but I still couldn't, and I had this terrible urge to make out with her but I stopped myself.

Different things "do it" for different people, and these feelings come in trends and waves over time. Sometimes, punting is just about "sneaking around and doing something exotic" more than it is about rubbing your member against the inside of her tunnel.

You'll need to come to terms with what "does it" for you. Although physical things like masturbating before a session will have an effect, I think the most important sex organ is the brain. Once you figure out how to make your brain feel sexy, the rest will follow. But you might have a frustrating spell while you figure it out.

Good luck getting through this part. So many feelings mixed up -- excitement, guilt, ethics, fear. Who could blame you if you have difficulties from time to time. I do too. For me, if the girl isn't fairly passionate, I find it hard. For me, DFK helps. For you, it may be something different.

FWIW, I've also had spells where I found it very pleasant to simply lie with a naked girl (or two) and talk and snuggle for a while, with no sex at all. Call me whatever you like, but in some cases, the "connection" that comes from talking and snuggling can be more powerful than the connection that comes from boom-booming.

Gherkin

An orgasm starts and ends in the brain.  

You are new at punting, and clearly have some negative thoughts about it (getting infected, etc.).  This is getting in the way.  You cant relax and be "in the moment" enough.  

Let me put it to you this way.  Imagine some crusty old man trying to give you a handjob.  He is providing all the physical stimulation needed, he might even have good technique.  Yet ya cant even get it up, never mind reach orgasm!  It's because your mind is absolutely repulsed by it.

All your anxiety about it is blocking you.

Again, I'm agreeing with this statement:  the strains of HPV that kill women have NO effect on men.  

My point is you can look at that from two perspectives ... you can say "Oh, in that case it's OK" because "it's not going to affect me".  That would be the selfish perspective.   
You can also look at it and say "Oh, here is something that is proven to be highly infectious, which might kill my partner if I ever catch it".  That would be the social perspective.  

Probably the hardest thing at this time is to get a clear medical opinion about what to do about the risk of HPV.  They do all agree women should get regular cervical smears, and they all agree that four strains of HPV in particular cause the majority of cervical cancer cases.  Beyond that, this seems to be an emerging area where there are more questions than there are answers, particularly relating to how to avoid catching it, and whether you can avoid catching it in the first place.  

Forget condoms, they don't cover enough [Egendorf, Laura. Sexually Transmitted Diseases (At Issue Series). New York: Greenhaven Press, 2007] ...
And even monogamy and chastity appears not to work as a completely reliable defense: http://www.medhelp.org/posts/STDs/Virgin-with-Hpv/show/379795

So at this time the consensus appears to be that everyone - male and female - should assume they will catch it and will pass it on.  

Not going to preach as to what you or any individual should do ... given even these few observations it's clear that his past history and his future expectations play a big part in what an informed and responsible man should choose.  HPV is an issue without a solution - my aim here is just to raise awareness, in the hope that more people will do more of their own research.  

... and on the antibiotics ...

I'm not going to argue with doctors who are doing surgeries: the risks of complications from surgery certainly warrant use of antibiotics even if there is a risk of side-effects.  Surgery is dangerous, period.  It is only done when there is some compelling threat to life that warrants the risk.  

But I will still raise my eyebrows sky-high at the news of anyone self-prescribing antibiotics, and doing so on a systematic and regular basis, which is what it sounded like you might be doing.  That is NOT at all the same thing as surgical prophylaxis.  

At the end of the day, ANY use of antibiotics carries with it the accelerated risk of evolution of a resistant strain of bugs.  

Bugs are routinely "genetically engineered" by sewage treatments plants, to evolve a culture of bugs that can handle a particularly toxic environment.  And the way they do this is by exposing an existing culture of bacteria to a low-level of the toxic material, and gradually increasing the concentration over weeks and sometimes months, until they end up with a culture of bacteria that can thrive in the harsh environment.  

To do that with beneficial bacteria who help us clean up the mess we make in our environment, is useful.  

To do it with harmful bacteria that cause disease is something that ... put it this way ... is enough to provoke me to be uncharacteristically voluble here!