as you know, for a HG/WG, identifying herself as a Japanese girl "allows" one to charge a premium on rates.

if a girl is of Chinese/Korean/Filipino/Thai ancestry but has lived/serviced in Japan for a few years, does that qualify her as "Japanese"?
if a girl is of Japanese ancestry but has lived say in the UK or in America for many years, does that qualify her as "Japanese"?
If a girl looks looks like a reasonable facsimile facial/body-wse of Maria Ozawa or Anna Ohura, can speak Japanese fluently, but has never set foot in Japan, does that qualify her as "Japanese"?

Bottom line - would you pay $1200HK or $1400HK for an HG one of the above as opposed to say 700 or 800?

Discuss away.

[ Last edited by  JeSun at 6-1-2010 08:43 ]

Would I? No.  But I'm not Japanese.  

I mean that literally - the Japanese seem to be hyper-sensitive to social ritual in pretty much every aspect of their lives.  I can see that to them, mixing with a foreigner could be intensely uncomfortable and require a constant effort of adjustment on their side.  We're brash, loud, emotional, and probably smelly too.  Perfectly likeable as guys or as business partners, just not in the same room with them, and not especially relaxing for them to be with.  Even more than most races, the Japanese feel most comfortable with other Japanese.  

Case in point the word Gaijin applies to anyone, and is derogatory not just to white guys or Asian immigrants, but across the board to anyone who's not Japanese by birth.  I have a friend who is 100% Japanese, was born in Japan, speaks fluent native Japanese, and went to school in Japan ... except he went to school in London for 5 years as a teenager ... and even he has trouble being accepted as "one of us" by Japanese simply because he's got some thought patterns that are not Japanese.  He told me once he has to watch himself constantly not to display his European side in a social context.  

So I can see their dilemma.  They're used to paying Tokyo rates and getting Tokyo service, but they're in Hong Kong.  They could pay half as much and get PRC quality, but as good as PRC quality is it's still missing that unique Japanese flavour that they miss.  It's missing the special sauce that you only get from a girl versed in the finer arts of Japanese courtesan-ship ... whatever that may be ... something that Japanese girls get drummed into them from their mother and all her female counterparts, subtly, unconsciously, since birth.  

It's a bit like an American friend of mine, who only ever eats out in Dan Ryans, Outback Steakhouse, and similar restaurants.  He's not being snobbish or racist, he's just so used to steak and chips he can no more enjoy an Asian meal than Paw-Paw can tolerate a meal without a bowl of rice and chopsticks in hand.

No wonder putting "Japanese" attracts more money - and no wonder we can't understand what the fuss is about.  They're just selling to a market that's on a different wavelength, and if they can get it, good luck to them.  

I just feel sorry for their Japanese clients who are getting a fake version of what they're looking for.

And equally, I have no doubt that a Gaijin afficionado can come to appreciate a true JG, just as we can come to appreciate just what it is that makes to a top-notch soba noodle or grilled eel with rice different from the Yoshinori version.  

Question is can we be bothered?

Id personally only pay the premium rate if i was certain they were Japanese by ancestry regardless and where they are born. As long as their parents are Japanese that makes their ethinicity Japanese.

He said "special sauce" mmmmmmm . . .  


I'm intrigued by the Japanese thing, but not enough yet to pay double.  Maybe someday the attraction of the "special sauce" will finally lure me.

Japanese WGs can command a premium in Asia because all the local guys grew up jacking off to Japanese porn - most guys over here probably learned all they know about sex from Japanese porn. That Japanese porn is a fantasy world bearing little relation to the sex lives of real Japanese is irrelevant. In fact, the popular press in Japan is constantly publishing the results of surveys that show the Japanese have the lowest level of sexual satisfaction of all Asian peoples.

And Dart, everything you say in those first paragraphs is true, but only for the men. Japanese women love foreign men precisely because we're a breath of fresh air; they can relax and climb out from under all the suffocating social restriction that weighs down on Japanese women.

Because of the above, being a Japanese-speaking foreigner in Japan is like being a water vendor in the desert. 15 years in Japan and the idea of paying for sex never even occurred to me! But then, there really isn't anything special about Japanese women: they're rather homely and no better in bed than any other women. So I wouldn't pay the premium here in HK even if these girls were Japanese, which they're not.

And please, let's not perpetuate this myth about stinky foreigners.

Totally concur Mars - I was very specifically talking about the men!  

Of course it is also true that a Gaijin will only ever meet a woman who is interested in Gaijin, the multitude of prejudiced and foreigner-phobic women will run a mile before you even see them brush the outskirts of the admiring crowd of eager pussy thronging around you   
As a Gaijin you won't even be allowed into the places where locals hang out, case in point: try getting into an Okiya ..!

But I disagree the myth about stinky foreigners is entirely a myth ... it's not entirely unfounded ... anyone on a diet that includes milk and cheese has a distinctive smell to someone from a culture that has little or no dairy in its diet.  A bit like the old UK prejudice that french = garlic muncher = smelly.  Not strictly true in individual cases but based nevertheless on an underlying cultural difference that can have an impact.

Dart, if I might ask, how familiar are you with Japan? As I understand it, an Okiya is where Geisha live; is any man - Japanese or foreign - allowed entry? In any case, there are only a handful of Geisha in all of Japan - I saw a couple in Kyoto on the street, many Japanese have never encountered one.

Almost all of the establishments where foreigners aren't allowed entry are run by men - most of the saunas that won't allow foreigners are Yakuza owned. Foreigners are denied entry because Japanese men don't like being around foreign men, especially in scenarios that have anything to do with sex - Japanese men are very insecure when it comes to sexual comparisons with foreigners.

I never had a good male Japanese friend in all that time in Japan because the Japanese male - unless he's spent many years abroad - simply can't relax around foreign men. There's even a well known term for it: gaijin complex.

I suppose there are a few Japanese women who don't fantasize about having a foreign lover. One certainly can't rule out the possibility.

You really do have a bee in your bonnet about this gaijin odor thing don't you?! Anyone who is healthy and regularly bathes isn't going to smell much different from anyone else. Of course, if you ingest a kilo of garlic a day you're going to stink - and I've heard Westerners complain about the garlicky odor of some Koreans, for instance - but those are going to be extreme cases.

[ Last edited by  Marsupial at 8-1-2010 12:14 ]

We certainly seem to be agreeing!!  

Anyone who's lost weight (and I mean seriously lost weight, losing fat they've been carrying for a decade or more) knows that being healthy and bathing doesn't prevent one from stinking.  

Anyway I'm not saying all "foreigners" stink - I know you know that - all I'm saying is that it is not a sign of prejudice or racism for people from one culture to notice a different smell coming from people from another culture.  How we react to that difference, and whether the difference in smell is so strong that we either commit or become victims of racism, is another matter.  I'm just saying there's a factual basis for the perception that foreigners (to any country) might smell different.

I might try once or twice for the sheer novelty and to see what the fuss is all about. If I feel there's nothing special or it aint worth it then no way am I going to pay that kind of premium again.

the point of the post was to see what you considered as Japanese, not whether you would do a Japanese girl or not.  Then given that, would you then pay a premium.

[ Last edited by  JeSun at 7-1-2010 00:54 ]

Japanese parents equals Japanese to me also.  I see your point about considering the social side of whether they're Japanese. I think I would pay extra occasionally, but I prefer less pretension so other nationalities suit me better.

maybe bro, but that's not the question you asked ...

just to be clear - many people have complained that most if not all the Japanese HGs are actually Korean.  So, would you pay $1200 or $1400 for a non-Japanese girl, even if the Korean girl was say living in Japan for many years; or maybe never set foot in Japan but could speak Japanese fluently.

I understand.  

My point is someone who responds to an ad for a "Japanese" WG in HK is more likely to be looking for a combination of cultural, etiquette, and service skills (and maybe language ability) than for genetic / ethnic origin.  

Would I pay for it?  No, I don't understand it and don't appreciate it, so I'm not a target prospect.  But IMHO what is being sought and advertised as a "JG" has less to do with the literal truth than in the way the girl looks acts and talks. By analogy the key part of "GFE" is the "E" not the "GF" - when looking for GFE we want the experience of an admiring girlfriend, not the reality.  In a similar way someone looking for a "JG" is looking for the experience of being served in a "Japanese" way (whatever that is) rather than the literal truth.

Of course the question of whether or not she actually delivers what she advertised is a completely separate question.  Assuming she DOES deliver, I can see people would reasonably pay extra.  If I get good service, I tip, and I revisit, and I usually avoid $250 girls unless she's a real gem in the rough.  

So I can see that paying extra for a Korean gal who can unlock the JG code for her client is reasonable.  

It would be more honest to advertise "Japanese Service" ... but that wasn't your question.  We're in an environment where a degree of exaggeration is the norm not the exception.

All the locals want to do a Japanese girl because they have this idea in their heads from all the porn that Japanese girls are really special. If that's your fantasy, a Korean girl who's lived/worked in Japan for many years isn't going to do the trick. I've lived in Asia for 30 years, but no one is going to confuse me for Chinese or Japanese no matter how well I speak those languages.

So for me, to be considered Japanese, the girl would have had to be born and raised in Japan. If she were a 2nd or 3rd generation Korean/Chinese-Japanese, I'd also consider her Japanese. But that's an American attitude. For instance, for my way of thinking, anyone (Orientals included) born and raised in the States is American. But the definition of American has more to do with citizenship than race. Here is Asia the two concepts are usually run together. It was only recently that a Westerner, for instance, could even become a Japanese citizen.

But I'm telling you guys, Japanese women are no different in bed from any other girl. What distinguishes Japanese as a people is their openness to sensual pleasure and the lack of social stigma about sexuality. Less restrictive societal attitudes towards sex explain the huge porn industry in Japan and why 99% of Asian porn is Japanese. The bizarre thing is that the Japanese are also morbidly shy. The randiness of Japanese women (obviously, men as well) and the shyness of Japanese men means that an aggressive foreigner in Japan can make out like a bandit.

Actually, now that I come to think of it, the shyness of Japanese men also helps explain why the porn industry is such a thriving business in Japan; the guys turn to porn to satisfy their need for sex because they find it so difficult to approach real women outside of a paid transaction.

I really like Japanese women. Having a Japanese GF is wonderful, but not much different than having a Chinese or Guailo GF as far as the sex is concerned. And to be honest, the average Japanese chick isn't that beautiful. The JGals in the GAl'DB - if the pics are accurate - are far more beautiful than almost all the WGs you'd come across in Japan. That, the low prices compared to going Japanese market rates, and all the very un-Japanese fake tits, tell me that these girls aren't in any sense Japanese.

[ Last edited by  Marsupial at 8-1-2010 12:18 ]

Ya, but the ironic thing is that almost all the reports of encounters with Gal'DB JGals state that the girls never allow DFK or DATY which are the very definition of GFE. And since many - all but one in my experience - of the Chinese HGs do allow DFK and DATY, if it's great service you want, avoid the fake Japanese.

The extra money only buys you the idea that you've actually had sex with a Japanese girl, whereas the reality is that she wasn't Japanese and the service lacked any semblance of so-called Japanese intimacy.

Yeah - I certainly avoid them, for myself ... especially with report after report being negative.  

Truth is I've yet to see ANY report raving about how a high $ hottie was worth every cent she wanted!  Not just rebadged KGs.  

So even without the reports my curiosity has been insufficient to venture as far as shelling out on an HG ... my skepticism about the service from monikered JGs is even higher ...

I don't know about that one D'Art . . . are you really saying that milk and cheese in the diet is MORE stinky than gallons of sake and cartons of cigarettes??!

Ah that's a GREAT question.

The thing about smell is WE ONLY NOTICE DIFFERENT SMELLS.  Any smell that we smell constantly, we simply don't notice at all.  That's why people with BO or bad breath can tolerate their own smell: they just don't notice it.  

A smoker will never find anything strange about the smell of another smoker.  Conversely (of course) someone who never smells cigarettes will be overpowered by the smell of a smoker regardless of whether he's actually smoking at that moment or not.  

Someone who's used to smelling crowds of people full of sake and cigarettes will instantly notice the difference in someone who is full of milk and cheese.  

It's a much more subtle smell.  But our noses are fearsomely sensitive to very subtle fragrances, as long as they're something different.

I can only conclude from this Dart that you have an freakishly sensitive nose.

Granted that a smoker will stink; even someone who has been around a smoker will carry away the stench on his clothes, but a healthy person who bathes regularly isn't going to have any kind of noticeable odor simply because he has a cafe latte and a container of yogurt for breakfast every morning.

I've had prolonged intimate contact with women of a dozen different nationalities and I've never noticed odd or unfamiliar odors about any of them. And none of these girls has ever mentioned anything about my individual odor - good or bad. I had one Japanese GF who said she liked the musky smell of men - I was her first gaijin, btw, so she wasn't drawn to foreigners because of some weird odor fetish thing like you mentioned in an earlier post - she once buried her nose in my armpit and seemed disappointed that she couldn't smell anything at all.

Odd body odor is, however, an indication of unhealth. Perhaps all those people who you think stink of meat and cheese are just unhealthy. Certainly a diet characterized by massive amounts of animal protein is unbalanced.

Just to empathize this, let me repeat: a non-smoker with no underlying physical problems who eats a healthy, balanced diet that isn't characterized by the regular addition of strong spicy ingredients, a person careful about bathing and general hygiene, is not going to have any noticeable odor - to a bloodhound, yes, but not to another human being.