No pisser, this thread started off being about how white guys love ugly Asian women, and all that that implies. Wasn't that obvious? If you didn't see that then you've misunderstood everything that's been said in this thread.


But then, as we've just seen, getting the point of things isn't eactly your strong suit now, is it?

@Pisser:  What do you mean, we?  I thought it was interesting
@Mars:  I love bananas, my ex was one

Seriously, Mars dude, I wasn't criticizing your post.  I just wanted to add a little information to the whole banana thing because I love biology.

I just wanted to make the point because other people will get concerned about racial differences, when in fact all humans pretty much share the same coding, with very slight variation.

These biological instincts that people have are really funny, because they tell people to preserve their own genes, yet at the same time they tell us to spread our own DNA far and wide with as many girls as possible.

Have you noticed how so many people dislike it when foreigners come to "take our women", but we see something exotic about non-local girls, and want to spread our seed with them?  It's all biology.

I, for one, don't mind foreign guys coming to take away local HK girls (good riddance to kong girls ), as long as we can return the favour by enjoying local flavours when we travel abroad.

One flavour worth tasting is.... wait for it.... banana

[ Last edited by  princeandnpg at 31-12-2009 16:56 ]

In fact St. Mars, isn't there only a 4 or 6% difference between human genes and those of the great apes?  I don't know what the difference would be for a pouch-reared non-eutherian guy like you but it can't be much more after only 130mm years of separate evolution.

Maybe I've just been assimilated as an American too long, but as a Chinese guy that grew up in the States (LA/Orange County area), I've never had any weird racial vibe against me.
Even when I visited Indianapolis (where I think I was the only Asian in the city), or Mississippi.  People would give me a curious glance, but they were all polite.
BTW, curious glances would be expected.  When you see a blonde girl, or black guy in China, all the Chinese people would be checking them out as well. It's just a problem of standing out from the norm.


As for the whole "racist" problem.... I feel that asian people are far more racist than caucasians.
Here's the litmus test for you:
X parents having an 18 year old girl.  If she were to marry/date a Y guy, it would be okay.
Fill in different racial groups for X and Y.

If X is Asian, Y seems to only be Asian (of the same country of origin, mind you), or White (if he's rich, and not too ugly).
A larger percentage of white parents would have a more open mind to other races.


My family, for example, is racist.  We're in the Philippines, and the filipinos are looked down upon (because we chinese are the "rich" people). I love my family, but seriously.... some of their stereotypical beliefs are just plain stupid.

A long time ago, when I still lived in the States, my dad told me: "You can date/marry any type of girl.  I don't mind..... as long as she's not BLACK!"
And he's the racially tolerant one of the family... Hahaha!

When I first came out to study Chinese in Taiwan in the late 70's, it would often happen that outside the center of Taipei, little kids would follow me down the street. Children would point at me and say waiguoren, or atoga (Taiwanese for 'big nose'). It was never malicious, they were just curious and usually very affectionate once they realized I could speak Chinese. Now, over here, no one pays foreigners much attention.

As a college student in Boston, I had a Chinese-American GF who I was desperately in love with. I saw her for a year until she moved away. I would often climb into her bedroom window (she lived with her parents on the 1st floor of a large apt building) and spend the night with her. However, in all that time, she never let on to her parents or brothers that she was seeing a white guy - she knew that they would never accept me.

People are by nature exclusionary; it takes time and familiarity to get us to accept those who appear different. William Gibson, considered the father of the cyberpunk subgenre of science fiction because of his novel Neuromancer, has stated that the final solution to racism will be "fucking" - that only when everyone is an indecipherable blend of different races, will people no longer attach any importance to race.

...as a Chinese guy that grew up in the States (LA/Orange County area), I've never had any weird racial vibe against me.
As for the whole "racist" problem.... I feel that asian people are far more racist than caucasians.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is my experience as well.  As a white guy, when I moved to the San Francisco area and started hanging out with Asians almost exclusively, right away the Japanese said "there is something I need to tell you about Koreans..."  Then the Chinese would say "don't hang around Japanese, they are animals".  Then Taiwanese would say "don't be friends with Filipinos, they are thieves and liars and lazy".  

There is also something else I've noticed about caucasians.  If caucasian-Americans see a white person, they think "hey, there is a white person".  If an English, German or French see a white person it is my opinion that many think..."God, I hope that's not an American".  Americans honestly don't care that much.  Even Caucasian and African American racism is way down in America.  If you want proof, look at our President.  I don't think we'll see a black President of China in the next 500 years, or of Japan, or of Germany, or Saudi Arabia.  So say what you want about caucasian-American racism, but at least we can pull that out and say "Fuck that, we elected a black brother to be our President".

Oh back to the main topic of the thread -- I'm looking at Lucy Liu's photo and I think I'm starting to see what the Asian guys are talking about.  Lucy Liu doesn't look that good and she does have a retarded, coutry girl look that is unattractive.  I have to give credit to them for sticking to their guns and telling us Non-Asians that we don't know what we're talking about.  She is kind of average to homely the more I look at her.  I guess for caucasians she has kind of comic book Asian features that we can easily identify and consider exotic.

[ Last edited by  grantorino2 at 2-1-2010 22:21 ]

Many people are actually racist without even being aware of it. There are tests here, if you want to check yourself.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/demo/selectatest.html

For Race: Black v White, the results indicate that ... "most Americans have an automatic preference for white over black."

Another story. During a recent trip back to Seattle, I was hanging out at the excellent Zoka coffee shop - one of the few places in coffee-crazy Seattle where you can actually find an espresso the approaches Italian-level quality. At the table next to mine were two real cute Korean-American university girls (U of Wash). One of them was telling the other how the parents are arranging a marriage for her with a Korean guy from South Korea that she had never met! She seemed to think this was the most natural thing in the world, there wasn't any resentment or anger in her voice at all. Even the other girl didn't seem to think it strange.

These were girls born and raised in the States, not some fresh of the boat Pakistanis. These were educated women who could have had any guy they wanted, yet they unthinkingly accepted the family dictating who to spend the rest of their lives with.

I'm told Korean women in the States are strongly discouraged against marrying out of the community.

It's interesting how expat communities everywhere see control of women as the most important means of maintaining ethnic purity and tradition.

I wonder if there is any white girls that only asians finds attractive =)

Definitely. See my post #70 for an example.

Yes... to get back on topic.....

I don't think Lucy Liu is particularly attractive.... I think it's the roles that she was playing, that made her attractive to a lot of people.
She was in Ally McBeal, and Charlie's Angels.  Very strong roles, with characteristics that makes you like her (well.... some won't, but a lot of people like her roles)

Another example of mediocre becoming "attractive" through the characters they play as, is Jennifer Anniston.
If she didn't play the role of Rachel Green in Friends, I wouldn't turn my head if she walked by. Funny nose, and generic looks.....

Mars, I disagree with the way you generally argue: find some walking anecdote that you bumped into, or something someone told you, and decide that this proves your point. Insofar as you're using your own prejudices to flesh out the details of the anecdotes, your argument is not only anecdotal, but also tautological. Your arguments are comically similar to "my Black friend just bought a Porsche, so this proves there's no racism in America."

And I can just see that you imagine yourself as the white knight that will save all those poor Asian girls from those horrible (horribly bucktoothed, sexist, brutish, backward) Asian men...

I started this thread, and that's certainly not what I intended. There are different tastes in beauty, and there's no such thing as objectively beautiful or ugly. When I say "LL is ugly," it's shorthand for "according to my subjective standards, LL is ugly." I just think it's an interesting phenomenon. We could also start a thread on Asian women whom only Asian men find attractive. I have a good female friend who has this problem: she likes white men, but she attracts only Asian men, because she's white-skinned and big-eyed (Cantonese!). Comparisons are always funny and interesting. Like in Chinese restaurants in the US, I like to look at what the Asians vs non Asians are eating, and of course they're completely different types of food. Not better or worse, just different. We could start a thread about that too.

And yet reggie in post #124 says "..as a Chinese guy that grew up in the States (LA/Orange County area) I've never had any weird racial vibe against me." He then goes on to say exactly what I've been saying. Do you also dismiss everything he says as just "anecdotal"? And exactly what are my prejudices?

btw, you haven't used the word 'tautology' correctly.

That might be what you intended, or what you thought you intended, but words have a meaning independent of the conscious intent of those who utter them. This thing about white guys finding ugly Asian women attractive has a long history that can't be ignored if you want to understand what's really going on under the surface. Just read some of the other posts which don't try to disguise the glee ABCs, etc, take in dumb white guys chasing butt-ugly Asian women.

As Caligynephiliac  says,

"But buried in here, there are a couple of interesting questions: 1)  The fact that this thread exists at all...  Why is it necessary for Asians to make fun of the inferred preferences of non-Asians?  [Marsupial may be right, it may have to do with resentment]"

It's tautological because your "evidence" is chosen to support your data, and you choose to ignore the many posts on this thiread that give firsthand accounts of anti-Asian racism. Actually, now that I think about it, your argument is a fucking farce. You claim that there's no such thing as a black swan by repeatedly quoting a few people who have never seen a black swan, while completely ignoring many people who have seen black swans.

And yes, what grantorino says is anecdotal, and doesn't prove anything. The old "my [insert ethnic minority] friend says there's no racism anymore" argument is laughable. Especially when alongside it there are so many firsthand reports to the contrary, some right on this forum.

I think we should go back to posting pictures of Asian women only whiteys consider hot! That was my original purpose.

My thinking is a farce?! So reggie's Asian-American experience is anecdotal but yours isn't!   And what do you mean 'grantorino'? At least read the posts you disagree with.

btw, cherry-picking evidence to support a pre-existing opinion is not the definition of a tautology. Look it up.

[ Last edited by  Marsupial at 4-1-2010 15:16 ]

well, I must have been the only one (Asian or white) in college who had the hots for Elizabeth Shue back in the early 80s.

I wasn't old enough to GET an erection in the early 80's but Leaving Las Vegas E.Shue was alright. If i were an alcoholic Nicholas Cage, I wouldn't pick anyone else to join me on my journey to liver failure.

And Mars, excuse me if I'm wrong, but if you've had a truly painful experience in your life as result of bias against your race, you wouldn't be so quick to comment on the 'fairness' and lack of prejudice that exists in the world.

That said, I do think that we, as asians, just love getting on our soapboxes just a little too much. Chinese people LOOOOVE to hate on other races. And I think the acceptance of non-caucasians in North America far outweigh the acceptance of non-Chinese in China... Just my two cents though.

The argument isn't whether Lucy Lui (or whoever) is THE standard of beauty, but whether a culture is broad enoughto have many different standards of beauty.  Here in the States we went through our own phase many decades ago of having a singular standard for female beauty.  Since then beauty that is distinctive, and the breadth of looks that brings with it, has become the common standard.

That means that 50 years ago you might have been a social outcast for dating an Asian (Hispanic, Black, Redhead) chick, now 'you da man!' for scoring such a 'hottie.'

I submit that Lucy Lui is attractive precisely because she has a distinctive look (and a hard-body )

Broad, diverse standards of beauty are enlightened, AND the path to more sex.   Yeah that's right, I said the path to more sex grasshopper.  Imagine if your esthetics were soooooo broad that you could fuck hairy, sweaty fat chicks.  Think about it: those girls are so desperate you'd have your pick of the pig litter.  You'd literally be getting BJs morning, noon, night and at tea time.  And don't even get me started on the butt sex, everybody knows fat girlsluuuuuuv butt sex!